SB-SGA Redux!

I don't think that they're Super Psionics, but they do have some ability in Psionics... at least I think so, so lie to the Jahre as few times as possible, that and I don't want to ruin KD's relationship with his girlfriend...

Crap, for some reason I had us on Turn 12, not Turn 13. Hrm. Okay, that's not as big of a deal as it could be...

Research List Proposal

Turn 14
1.) Shields 2 (Bubble Shields) (Finish) (I hope so, anyways. This is getting a bit ridiculous.)
2.) Power 3 (M/AM Reactors) (Note: Extreme Caution will be undertaken with this research, due to the potentially destructive nature of it)
3.) FTL Drives 2 (Alpha-Band Hyperdrives)
4.) Artificial Intelligence 1 (*Placeholder for official name*)

Turn 15
1.) Power 3 (M/AM Reactors) (Note: Extreme Caution will be undertaken with this research, due to the potentially destructive nature of it) (Finish)
2.) FTL Drives 2 (Alpha-Band Hyperdrives) (Finish)
3.) Artificial Intelligence 1 (*Placeholder for official name*) (Finish)
4.) Projectile Weapons 2 (Naquadah-Enhanced Nuclear Weapons)

Turn 16
1.) Projectile Weapons 2 (Naquadah-Enhanced Nuclear Weapons) (Finish)
2.) Electronic Warfare 1 (STL Sensor Spoofing)
3.) Communications 1 (Whisker Lasers)
4.) Stealth 2 (*Placeholder for official name*)

Turn 17
1.) Electronic Warfare 1 (STL Sensor Spoofing) (Finish)
2.) Communications 1 (Whisker Lasers) (Finish)
3.) Stealth 2 (*Placeholder for official name*) (Finish)
4.) Cybernetic Technologies 2 (Fast Learning Enhancements)



Reasoning: Turn 14 and 15 should give us the core techs we need to get our ships to an acceptable level of performance. Medical 4 is, mainly, to help our men in the field. 16 is more ship-centric tech, in anticipation of us needing some fleet action soon. The learning tech should be self-evident as for why.

After 17, I would say we should start trying to get more of our stuff to at least level 3 (so, enhancing our Materials, Sensors, and so forth), if not level 4. We shouldn't take Computers as a guidepost, as other techs may top out at 5, 6, or even 8. But we're going to have to sacrifice some techs, at least early on; as much as I want to try unlocking Wraith tech right away, I think we need to shore up more of our existing tech base first. Once we're at Level 3 on more techs, then I'd feel comfortable delving into that tree.

As for the "Hidden Tech" that we've unlocked 1/3 of....curious as I am, without knowing what else is required, I'm not structuring my proposal to specifically try to achieve it.

But we still need Stealth 2 to make sure the Wraith can't track them through Hyperspace...

I'm saying this because that is literally the only way we'll get WV to let us use the damn things...

I guess we could take out Med 4 from its place and pop in Stealth 2...Or rather, I'll shuffle some other stuff around, because I think we need FTL 2 to be developed before we can do Stealth 2. Give me a minute on that.

EDIT: Okay, Med 4 is off the table for the moment, shuffled PW 2 up, and Stealth 2 is now on the table.

Ok

WV's Tuna + KD's Research Proposal: (WV, Hawke)

Note: Thrax has said that Power III will unlock Antimatter weapons, but they'll be expensive...take of that what you will.

and, the Stalingrad Class is a working design, the final design will be submitted once we have at least the techs I absolutely need for the design...it may have a few extra features and stuff...like Communication and Electronic Warefare...

The Jahre obviously tell people "no" all the time when they ask for advanced tech. See the Satedans. They may or may not react well if you do so. Depends on the dice. They would understand your reasoning either way if you told them "it's a national security asset."

I... am going to be throwing you guys a bone in regards to manpower sometime soon. You'll like me and hate me when I announce it, though. Probably mucho hate.

You have access to the best Jahre intel. You know what her territory looks like, and you have pictures and analysis from the Jahre of all the Protectorate worlds under her control, in greater or lesser detail (though Gate defenses are pretty well laid out on all of them). They have not a clue what Hoff's defenses are and dialing the gate, then tossing probes through has been ineffective-- there's obviously an Iris up or the Gate has been buried.

Design roll would do it, as it's tech that your SGC scientists have explored already. It'd take up two slots out of the four you're allowed with writeins, though, to compensate for the SGC not using it and the scientists being rusty. Your first ship design is free, though, so Hawke's Stalingrad won't cost you a slot. It'd give you more bang for your buck than C9000, but it'd be much less precise and very unstable.

I believe I said it would be a bad idea to rely on the Normandy only. She's not big enough, nor powerful enough, to fight Wraith ships without a substantial tech advantage that you don't have right now.

Also, I'm working on some potential Achievements for a special action coming up in the intermediate future. Through The Fire and Flames, Guttering Flame, and [REDACTED] Pyre. You'll only see one depending on how you do, though.

Turn 14 Action and R&D Proposal

Action List

1.) Continue expanding industry. More miners and fabbers. Continue mining efforts on all planets with good mineral potential.

2.) Provide ATA Therapy and Cybernetics Injections for everyone. Work on getting everyone up to speed on "Know the Flow" Mental Exercises.

3.) Continue construction of Omega Site. Include building up food stores with excess food production.

4.) Design Roll (Designs listed below)

5.) Continue repairs of docking pier, in anticipation of beginning ship production next turn (and thus needing a place to put them). Start constructing distributed quantum computer networks to assist in repairs of damaged Ancient AI, as well as to improve our overall computer network.

6.) Diplomacy.
--Continue efforts with Tanians, working to at least make them trust us fully. Per their wishes, no mining anywhere near their settlements. If they're all concentrated on one side of the planet, perhaps consider asking them if we can mine on that opposite side (this is only to be asked if our diplomats think it wouldn't shoot us in the foot).
--Continue brewery trade!
--Continue anti-slaver missions with Satedans. Also, they will be included in the larger operation (another action). Otherwise continue trade and aid as appropriate.
--Continue working with Jahre. Goal here is to keep balance of trust/truth and of not revealing everything. Reveal to them our most up-to-date sensors; if they press for how those showed us where the Wraith were, state that we don't wish to reveal our exact locations, but that we are not notably close to Sateda, and apparently we're simply further "out" than where the Jahre are (hence our caution!). We do not in any way hint at us holding Atlantis, but we also make sure to in no way lie about anything in this area (or any other area). Our people are under orders such that, if they are pressed too hard, they simply state currently they cannot reveal much else, due to national security concerns.

7.) Work on tracking and mapping Wraith movements near New Avalon, Arcadia, and Desolation (to give us a good sample size), but use sensors on any and all planets we have them on.

8.) Continue planning, preparing, and drilling with the Satedans (and possibly the Jahre?) on striking at Saro's world of Hoff, as well as other worlds. Try to set up a plan that has us working "inwards", starting with the more "outlying" worlds and working our way inwards. Include plans for, if necessary, evacuating inhabitants to other worlds; consult with allies on what best location or locations may be (so whether it's Tania, Arcadia, one of the Satedan worlds, or whatever). Try to find ways to overcome Gate defenses on high-level Protectorate worlds, encouraging both "traditional" ideas, and more outside-the-box thinking. (Ships are out of the question, mainly due to both distances and tech levels, at least on our part.)


Research and Development List

1.) Shields 2 (Bubble Shields) (Finish) (I hope so, anyways. This is getting a bit ridiculous.)
2.) Power 3 (M/AM Reactors) (Note: Extreme Caution will be undertaken with this research, due to the potentially destructive nature of it)
3.) FTL Drives 2 (Alpha-Band Hyperdrives)
4.) Artificial Intelligence 1 (Virtual Intelligences)


Design Details

*.)Heavy Frigate (Free Design)
1&2.) Naquada/Potassium Warheads (Non-nuclear explosives)
3.) C-9000 Grenades (multiple sizes, intended for various weapons)
4.) Battle Network

Councilman Knight Communication With Captain Pokun

Interesting...
Basically, let's assume this keeps up, though when I run into the multi-media stuff, I try to see if I have all the "pieces", and if I don't, I ask her for them.

Lemon? Wacky. I try to see if I have any references to such a thing in all the bits and pieces of literature and such that she's sent me.

I explain the basics, including that, at least at times, it's been strictly volunteer-composed, though necessity has driven us otherwise. I shoot for general impressions rather than specifics. Stuff like "every Marine a rifleman" and all that, army of professionals, etc. Basically how our general trend is "quality over quantity", and that training occurs off and on throughout a soldier's career.

I make sure our plans are finalized.

"There's no such thing as a free lunch."
I make sure my next packet of literature has similar bits of wisdom and "wisdom".

YES.

I explain that many cars were originally designed for necessity (pictures of landboat sedans, old old trucks, things like that), but that as time and fortune came along hobby and luxury could step in. I express hope that the Jahre will eventually have the space and resources to give themselves a chance to have more hobbies like that.

...YES
Ahem. At any rate, I make it know that such things aren't strictly off-limits, but that if we see degradation in performance, rules will tighten up (in other words, do your jobs, and this is fine).

I offer to send an extra copy, and/or send any expansions or mods (an idea I explain to her) that they might lack but still desire.

Random Rolls for Turn

2, 9, 29

Wait, now I'm confused. Last turn we examined the territory of a "Saro", but now you're talking about a "Hoff" (unless it's secretly....David Hasslehoff ). Which is it!

As far as stability of the warheads: Fair enough. How worthwhile would it be to consider putting it on micro-missiles? As well, do we just need to improve Projectile Weapons and Material Sciences to get better non-nuclear explosives, perhaps? I emphasize non-nuclear both because of potential shortages of plutonium/uranium, and its rather toxic effects in an atmosphere (since we use them for defense).

Otherwise, my roll proposal is up, pending a couple clarifications, all our design rolls decided on, etc etc.

Therefore we go with national security asset

It's pretty hard to get me to hate it i bet. ( Then again remember what i claimed to be in the IRC. )

I thought our engineers said that mirco missiles for defensive proposes are useless just this
turn?

Also we have shown them basically our latest sensors since we haven't updated ( researched sensors 3) our sensor tech so it isn't any better than it was when we did.

Micro-Missiles likely aren't seen as good for base defenses at the moment because of the warhead, I'd wager. And, perhaps to a point, the range.

The whole point of a Naq/K warhead is to increase the kill-power of the missiles, such that they're more viable. Thus, we can pack more destructive power in a smaller package. I thought that was pretty clear from how I worded that.

KD's Tuna: (KD, Hawke)

Thrax, How would a ship of the Stalingrad Class, as it stands now in the Write In, operate compared to the Normandy?

Payload isn't the biggest problem it seems to be range.

The reason i brought micro missiles up in the first place was to be used on fighters so they could have a larger missile payload when they get into a fight with the wraith because of just how much they'll be outnumbered that they'll need something to even the odds as much as they can before they enter dog fighting range. Or as something for our ground troops to deploy as support or swat darts out of the sky.

Your trying to use them as completely normal missiles which they are not these were in my mind meant to be used against swarms of darts rather than base defense as they simply cannot hold enough fuel for the ranges needed for base defense.

If i sound rude then i apologize since that isn't my intention with this.

Anouther question Thrax, how would a Secondary Warp Drive fit into the Stalingrad Class, as you've seen in the design I've thought up 2 backup systems and I was wondering if I would be able to add this to that list...

WV: Well, in my defense, I didn't say put them as base defenses.

I envision them, at the moment, being used in 2 places.
1.)Armament for some of our Powered Armor designs (which nobody seemed to mind at all)
2.)Crammed in pods slapped on our ships to be used specifically to kill Darts. The idea being that if MMs can get enough punch to take out a Dart all by themselves, we can kill a lot of darts with one ship.

Those are the only 2 things I have in mind. That's why the bit about "unstable" doesn't worry me too much, at least not for the ships. We just make sure their pods have a good layer of armor next to the hull, and if they blow, they blow outward (like Battletech CASE). If they're too unstable, I'd say the PAs would need to stick with just C9000 warheads.

Does that make any sense, at least? Seem somewhat reasonable and all?

That is indeed reasonable. Though naqadah is pretty stable as long as we keep the potassium safely stored in the missile until it time though safety precisions never hurt.

Anyway here's my criticisms about your action list. ( go ahead and make one for mine seriously. )

Actions 5, 6, 7, 8

5) Get rid of the "in anticipation of beginning ship production next turn" and I'll be much happier with it since we are not going to be building any ships next turn since if we're going to build any of the Stalingrad ships we should make them a finished product rather than having to refit them a bunch of times before they even meet their design.

6) With the Satedan's i don't think they do many if any anti-slaver missions since they're much more concerned with finding ways to fight the wraith rather than deal with a bunch of assholes being assholes.

With the Jahre showing them the sensors is pointless as you would merely be doing it again as we have most likely shown them off last turn and the up-to-date doesn't really mean jack since we haven't researched sensors 3 meaning our sensors are no better than last turn. If they pressure us simply respond with "it's a national security asset." since as forgo mentioned they'll accept that also it keeps things simple. Also make sure you know ( ask the GM ) how far away from Satedan we are before mention that but we don't know how far away the Jahre are so can't mention anything there. My opinion of the Jahre relations is that they are a friendly neutral country who have brought forward business but not much in the way of friendship. For allies i point to Satedan considering how much trading we do with them, the fact they let us have a embassy on their home world, joint missions etc. Then again their bellow us in tech and are very willing to work with us in order to hopefully get their hands on some of our tech for them selves.

7) We may want to know how much of the galaxy our sensors cover before i decide to support this.

8) Be sure to add that we doing these exercises using abandon planets also if we sent the probes to those planets from the SGC i must facepalm hard. We will be launching these operations from abandon planets.

You've mined plenty of fissile material, so that's not a problem. However, the nuclear weapons that are a part of naquadah nukes are just present to "pump" the naquadah. You could use the naquadah bomb designs and replace the nukes with C9000 to get a clean explosion. In addition, you could potentially use lasers to design a pure fusion warhead, if you so desired.

WV's point is mostly correct. The Micro-Missiles are basically Stingers, with a C9000 warhead and an ADF/F engine. They're built for low range and high speed, because Darts are frickin' fast (higher-tech engines) and can turn on a micrometer. They also have to score a direct hit to damage a dart. To compensate for these shortcomings, Micro-Missiles are build to accelerate very quickly and have a short total flight time, which lowers range, and they're still not guaranteed to hit unless a Dart is within a kilometer or two. N-P warheads won't be quite as energetic as Nirrti's bomb, but they will allow for a limited area-effect hit, which will help increase lethality. Still have range problems.

If you want to engage darts at range, use the RIM-116AFs in pods.

More room you use on backups, the less room you have for guns, shields, power, everything else... -shrug-

In space, at close range, that might work. As I said earlier, however, they're not long-ranged and darts have better engines, so... final protective fire yes, medium-to-long range, no.

Now, researchable techs...

Electronic Warfare I (STL Sensor Spoofing)
Projectile Weapons II (Naquadah-Enhanced Nuclear Weapons)
Shields II (Bubble Shields) (1/2 done)
Medical IV (Energy Mediated Healing Devices)
Cybernetic Technology II (Fast-Learning Enhancements)
Biological Technologies I (Ancient Genetics)
FTL Drives II (Alpha-Band Hyperdrives)
Materials Science III (Metamorphic Materials)
Power III (M/AM Reactors)
Wraith Studies I (Wraith Physiology)
Communications I (Whisker Lasers)
Stargate Operations I: Stargate Logging
AI I: Virtual Intelligences

I anticipate it taking more than 1 turn to build a ship. Thus, planning to incorporate tech we will be developing isn't unreasonable, especially if we leave space in the frame to add said tech in later on.

Considering our Quantum Computers are going to give us the ability to make our overall computer system in the ship absurdly compact, I think we can spare the room, and Hawke explicitly made room.

As well, we need to start making ships ASAP. You have seen how Forgo said it's a really good idea to make them, right? Again, we should plan for construction taking more than one turn on them.


Satedan operations: Our last turn explicitly had us hitting slavers. So....yeah, they kinda do take on the Ascendant. Really, all we have to do is convince them of the utility of hampering the Ascendant (which our GM has explicitly said is required to form a true alliance). If nothing else, paint it as going after the weaker target first.

As far as the Jahre...to be honest? I'm kind of going to ignore you here. It's clear you're not going to listen to reason on this, and are far too suspicious of them and their motives.

That said....GMs, have we shown the Jahre our currently developed sensor tech before, in detail?
And my whole bit about placement and such is predicated upon our understanding of galactic geography.

Frankly, if we keep doing things how you want us to, we will never ever gain the Jahre as allies.


I...I don't see how coverage is a huge thing. Any insight into the Wraith nearby, even just a few parsecs away, is kind of crucial.


...Yes, it can be assumed the exercises are being conducted somewhere where it's safe to train. That's why they're training exercises.

We really need to get a design for portable stasis chambers once we get medical 4.

Required techs i think were mentioned for it were as far as i can remember.

Materials 3
medical 4
shields 2

and that's all i can remember.

Edit:

... I point to hawke. Also i find your diplomacy seems to mainly consist of throw whatever we can at them to make them like us more. And as you have i shall also ignore your opinion about the Jahre from here on out.

Well that was ambigous... How 'Hearty' is the STL2 Hyperdrives? I mean, how much punishment can they take damage wise?

And WV is right, The Block 1 Stalingrads are gonna have to Have: FTL2, AI1, Power3(Debatable), Shields2, and Stealth2...anything else is icing on the cake or already researched

While I will say that Shields2 is already on my list, and Materials 3 would be great, Medical 4 Stasis Chambers can be added in an Upgrade/refit later

EDIT: Thrax, which has more Overall Damage, Spinal Plasma Cannon, or a Spinal Plasma Repeater? I originally thought that the DPS of the Plasma Repeater might make it an improvement of from the typical Plasma Cannon Spinal, but then I had a thought about the Pure Damage of Each Plamsa Cannon 'Slug'....Which would be more effective/powerfull as the Stalingrad's Main Gun.

Hyperdrives are buried at the center of the ship, along with the reactors, usually. They're well armored. Basically, if someone's shooting up the hyperdrive you're already in big trouble. You COULD fit a backup warp drive, but FTL drives take up at least 5% of ship volume, and if you have to fit two... make that 12.5% or so, as you're building redundant systems. Not to mention that the secondary systems for FTL drives are different depending on the type of drive (IE, you need different sensors, external ports, etc for warp than you do for hyper).

DPS is higher on the plasma repeater. Damage per shot is higher on the plasma cannon, but it fires much slower. You're probably better off using a plasma repeater.

Updated DM ruling. It's a Medical 4, Shields 2, Computers 4 to make a coffin-sized stasis pod that slows down the body to about 10% of elapsed time, similar to a Schlock Mercenary cryokit. With Bio 2 and Cybernetics 2, you can make a portable version that's 30cmx30cmx10cm and can slow down the body about the same as the previous model, or a coffin-sized model (like the ones built into Atlantis' medbay) that slows down experienced time to effectively 0.

Mmm. Both of you have points.

Thanks Thrax, that's all I wanted to know.

*peanut munching*

So, Plasma Repeaters are from the 'Spray and Pray' school of though?

I wouldn't say that Durabys, the ship still has a targeting system for it's guns. you could theoretically Spray and Pray, but why would you need to with a targeting system.

Ok then. Retracting my idea.

You submitted an Idea, I don't remember it, repost it and we'll give it some thought.