Professor Layton VS Ace Attorney Loops

Discussion in 'Creative Writing' started by OathToOblivion, Jan 13, 2014.

  1. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    Alright, this is just to get you situated with how The Infinite Loops actually work.

    Loop mechanics (general):

    One person in a Loop, often the main character, is an Anchor. They are the person who first starts time looping.
    There is always at least one Anchor present in a given Time Loop snippet, though it may not be the local one.
    The standard pattern for a Loop is that the Anchor (and whoever else is Looping there) come to awareness in a loop at a particular point in the story. From there, events will play out as influenced by the Loopers present, acting with the benefit of their foreknowledge, until either a predetermined end point is reached or all the Loopers have copped it.

    To be Awake is to be aware of the Time Loops (that is, to have gone back in time this time.)
    The Anchor is the only character guaranteed to be Awake. Even after others have started Looping, it is mostly random as to whether they will be Awake this particular Loop.

    Crossovers, fusions, and alternate pasts can also take place. It is perfectly possible, for example, to have the characters Awaken into a Loop which conforms to a fanfic universe rather than reality.
    Loops do not have to be in chronological order, but it is strongly preferred that they not require a mutually contradictory order (where A must be before B and B must be before A.)

    Just about every Looper is very, very stir crazy.

    Tvtropes page: The Infinite Loops / Fan Fic - TV Tropes

    Loops covered by this thread:

    Loop: Ace Attorney
    Anchor: Phoenix Wright
    Admin: Maat
    Loopers: Miles Edgeworth, Maya Fey, Trucy Wright, Franziska von Karma, Apollo Justice, Athena Cykes, Simon Blackquill, Dick Gumshoe, The Judge

    Loop: Professor Layton
    Anchor: Hershel Layton
    Admin: ?
    Loopers: Luke Triton

    Loop: Socrates Jones: Pro Philosopher
    Anchor: Socrates Jones
    Admin: Unknown as of now
    Loopers: Ariadne Jones

    WARNING: Unmarked Ace Attorney spoilers through Dual Destinies, including Investigations 2 (use fan translation for English stuff)

    Google Docs:
    • Creation of Turnabout's Joy (Ace Attorney/Five Nights at Freddy's) - COMPLETE
    • Turnabout Mario Sunshine (Ace Attorney/Super Mario Sunshine) - IN-PROGRESS
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2015
  2. Masterweaver

    Masterweaver Teller of Tales Bard Of Awesomeness

    Give us something to work with for this verse, please.
  3. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    Just to be clear: feel free to come up with your own Loop snippets! Obviously, I have final say on which are Canon or not, but I'm not stopping you guys from writing.

    1.1 - This is probably somewhere within Phoenix's first 15 Loops

    Phoenix Wright sighed. He still didn’t understand why he seemed to be reliving his life over and over again, but it was still an enormous pain. For one thing, whatever was controlling this couldn’t make up its mind on when he started. One time he started at his very first Trial, defending Larry against a guy who, in retrospect, was painfully obvious as the guilty party. The next, he started all the way back during the Class Trial, when he and Edgeworth had become friends. A couple of times, he even started back in college, when he had first been put on Trial!

    The first time it had happened, he had written it off as a dream of some kind, and while it seemed a bit eerie that his dream was forecasting reality, he didn’t pay much attention to it. But when it happened again, he knew that something had gone wrong in the Universe, and as usual, he was the one it was picking on.

    It was getting frustrating, having to explain this to his friends over and over again. Sometimes, they ended up thinking he was crazy and avoided him. Other times, he ended up being too hasty in playing his hand because he knew how it would turn out, only for him to lose anyway. Still, he persevered through, remembering what Mia had taught all those years ago back in his first life. “The only time a lawyer can cry is when it’s all over.”

    This time around, he had a plan in mind, even if the whole world would reset the day after the Phantom was caught in his first life. He had realized a long time ago that a lot of the problems that had happened in his first life had arisen mainly because of the structure of the Legal System. He had attempted to fix this with the Jurist System, but because of his disbarment and the public’s loss of faith, it had never seen the light of day asides from the one Test.

    What he figured, was if he could prevent the Dark Age of the Law, he might be able to get the reforms passed much sooner, thus ensuring a more fair Legal System by the time Apollo and Athena became lawyers. Edgeworth was already pretty much guaranteed to be Chief Prosecutor again, so all he needed to do was not get disbarred. And who knows! Maybe THIS is why he's been reliving his life over and over again.

    Still, he needed to get through this Trial first. He had stuck it by ear the entire time this life, making sure that everything had gone as it did back during his first life. And now, here he was again... the Trial of Shadi Enigmar, better known as Zak Gramarye.

    "Incidentally, don't even think of showing us this diary I've just shown the Court. Now that we've come this far, I hope you have something a little more...decisive. Show us evidence that the victim continued writing in his diary!" were the words from Rookie Prosecutor Klavier Gavin. It was here that everything had gone wrong all those lifetimes ago. Now, it was time for him to get it right!

    "I'll admit, it's not exactly decisive in a way that I'd usually go for," said the Turnabout Terror. "But then, this case requires a little out-of-the-box thinking. You'd agree, Prosecutor Gavin, that Magnifi Gramarye undoubtedly would have written on the last page if he had the chance?"

    Gavin smirked. "Naturally, Herr Wright. But even if he did so, the last page is still missing!"

    Phoenix stayed with a neutral look on his face. "I'm aware of that, but if he did write on that last page, then he would have had to use a bit more force, since only the cover would have been behind that page, right?"

    Gavin's smirk started faltering as he processed the information. "Y-yes, of course!"

    It was then that Phoenix let a smile grow on his face. "In that case, let's be a bit more old-school with this. Why don't we examine the back cover of the diary, and do a pencil-rub of it to see what he wrote on it? There, I'm not using the diary as you presented it to the court earlier." It was a neat loop-hole that he hadn't seen the first time around, but really, prosecutors should NOT be allowed to just out and deny the use of evidence like that.

    The Judge...whose name still escaped Phoenix even after all this time, saw no problem with this, and ordered a Baliff to bring in a pencil and rub the back of the Diary, revealing...

    "I hereby give all rights to the secrets, staging, and performance of my magic to the recipient named below.

    Recipient: Zak Gramarye"

    Klavier was flabbergasted. He had no doubt expected falsified evidence, like his brother had warned him about. But no, Phoenix Wright had gotten Shadi Enigmar off without using anything but the evidence discussed in court.

    The Judge had this to say. "Well...I believe that's that! It's clear now that the Defendant would have had no reason to kill the Victim. While Valant Gramarye's own role in this is still suspect, I am now ready to hand down my verdict."
    "This Court finds the Defendant, Shadi Engimar..."​
    "That is all. Court is now Adjourned!"​
    Phoenix was calm on the outside, but inside... "YEAH! FINALLY, I GOT HIM OFF! IN YOUR FACE, KRISTOPH!" After all this time, he was finally able to get Shadi Enigmar off the hook without getting disbarred in the process. While it would still be a while before everything could be fixed, at the very least, he wouldn't spend 7 years playing Poker.​
    Almost 9 years later...
    Phoenix Wright woke up after groping around for his alarm clock, remembered what the date had been yesterday, and checked the calendar.​
    August 3rd, 2016
    "GOD DAMNIT!!!!!" :mad:
    Poor Phoenix...let's hope his first Fused Loop is with Equestria...​
  4. Yeah...No. Phoenix ain't that lucky. I'm betting the Code Geass Universe where he has to defend Suzaku Kururugi at his military trial.
  5. TerraBull

    TerraBull Getting things done, RIGHT!

    Would he meet up with Harvey Birdman?
    Old Soul, GammaTron and darkdigi like this.
  6. Emral282

    Emral282 Touch Fluffy Tail

    I'm wondering who is gonna be the 2nd looper in this setting. Maya? Edgeworth? Mia? Larry?

    Actually, I wonder how the Fey shenanigans react to Nick. I'm pretty sure Mia knows him well enough to tell he's hiding something big if the loop starts at Phoenix's first case.
  7. More likely than MLP, that's for sure.
  8. TerraBull

    TerraBull Getting things done, RIGHT!


    Tuxedo Wright!

    Unless he ends up learning how to 'Shout'.
  9. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    Hope you realize, I'm completely stealing that. :D
    More seriously, I meant what I said; you guys are free to come up with your own Loop snippets!
  10. Filraen

    Filraen Bastion of the Fourth Wall

    Since most cases are defined by errors the defendants make in court Phoenix must get very good at (a) following a script of action to have the real culprits make the same mistakes or (b) have enough presence of character to force culprits to make equivalent errors.
  11. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    ...I have no idea what you mean. Could you be a bit more detailed over what you mean?
  12. Filraen

    Filraen Bastion of the Fourth Wall

    Dee Vasquez, the statue head was/n't there!

    Damon Gant, making him say the scrap of cloth was important.

    Luke Atmey, how do you know the defendant was wearing those clothes?

    Furio Tigre is the most blatant example with Phoenix playing a gambit to make him say the color/form of the poison bottle.

    And that's only from the top of my head on the first trilogy (I haven't finished Dual Destinies yet)

    If any of those wouldn't make that an error to tell the truth Phoenix would have lose each trial. Now with the loops the general events would have started more or less equal but by the same actions of Phoenix's they may not end saying the same things.

    in other words, I can see the trials in-universe being "on a tightrope", to say, and due to the variations in the loops[1] it'd be very easy for Phoenix to screw up and have a bad ending on his cases. Which would probably suck for him because, even after all what happened he still got the Good Ending in most cases (all playables except when he got disbarred) the fist time.

    [1] A few times it even happens because they are underestimating Phoenix
    Generalissimo likes this.
  13. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    Okay, now I get what you mean. You have to remember, this is Phoenix post-Dual Destinies who's Looping. You saw how much of a Chessmaster he was in Apollo Justice when he focused in on one specific case for an extended period. While he wasn't AS much of one after he got his badge back, he still seemed a bit more Guile than he was in the original trilogy. So he deliberately tries to make everything go exactly how he remembers it, and even in variant Loops, with all of his experience, his usual Turnabout skills can make sure he doesn't lose.
    That, and Maat, the Admin in charge of the Ace Attorney Loops realized how unfair the universe seems to be to Phoenix and deliberately programmed the baseline Loops so that the culprits would more or less trip up in the same way to throw him a bone.
  14. Leonite

    Leonite The Kaminamuffin. Kaminacake if you prefer.

    Ah, but twisting around the loops so that the trials change, so that the details change, stops it from getting stale.

    Incidentally, given this is post DD, the second looper is honestly one of four choices. Maya, for being so close to Phoenix. Edgeworth, for much the same reasons. The Judge... because he's in every game without fail. And Apollo.

    If I get inspiration, I might drop by a loop, but for now, I focus.
  15. Filraen

    Filraen Bastion of the Fourth Wall

    I don't believe that, if only because he won't have Mia killed if he can help it[1][2]. And after that, because he's going to ask for the Fey clan help on this thing of time resetting itself[3]. I can even see Phoenix undergoing some training himself as he completed the secret training course after T&T and his trouble with going back in time is clearly paranormal.

    [1] Or Misty while we are at it, if the butterflies haven't removed that murder attempt.

    [2] And it should add Diego Armando a lot of time later, when he goes looping on other worlds and learns a good enough healing techniques which would make Phoenix realize he can save him.

    [3] Sure, the Fey clan won't be able to help him in the Time Loops but it's the only tie Phoenix has with the paranormal.
  16. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    Keep in mind, this is only during his first few Loops, where he thinks the Universe is imploding because of his disbarment. Once he realized it doesn't matter what he does after the Loop snippet I wrote above, THEN he'll start messing around with stuff.
  17. Filraen

    Filraen Bastion of the Fourth Wall

    So you say "after Phoenix realizes it doesn't matter what he does in the Loops, Phoenix will stop preventing Mia from getting killed"? :wtf:
  18. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    What, NO!! After he realizes it doesn't matter, he WILL prevent Mia from getting killed. Why on Earth would you interpret it like that?!
  19. Filraen

    Filraen Bastion of the Fourth Wall

    So you're saying he will let Mia get killed until he realizes her living or dying won't matter?
  20. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    ...Considering there is proof of an afterlife and communication from the afterlife, does it really matter? Also, I changed my mind. Sometimes the Starting Point is after Mia's death, which it was in the above Snippet. Now, stop trying to put words in my mouth, alright?
  21. Filraen

    Filraen Bastion of the Fourth Wall

    You made a very good point about Ace Attorney's afterlife, and I had forgotten about that.

    What was my point? Phoenix will try to save everyone he cares about first, and deal with the consequences second. In the games[1] the first person Phoenix can save is Larry through the trial. The second will probably be Mia herself, trying to have her not being killed, etc. I can even see him try to save Russell Berry to prevent his killer-to-be from becoming a murderer. And then try to build it with a "best ending" being his eventual goal.

    And that's even before he gets his "welcome to the multiverse" talk.

    [1] release date order
    Generalissimo likes this.
  22. That's the tricky thing I feel about this loop. If you know that someone would get murdered, wouldn't you want to prevent it? Even if it meant you won't have a client to defend because the mira... er... murder never happened?

    Anyway, another idea for a derailing loop attempt would be to change the outcome of the IS-7 Incident trial (aka von Karma penalty trial). Since that trial is what led to DL-6 and all the trouble with the Feys. (even Dahlia's crimes). Not sure if it would Phoenix or Edgeworth who would try to lead Gregory to the truth. More likely Edgeworth though, since he help resolved the IS-7 incident 18 years later, but Phoenix would probably try to get the details from Edgeworth if Phoenix thought saving Gregory would stop the loops.
    Filraen and OathToOblivion like this.
  23. Leonite

    Leonite The Kaminamuffin. Kaminacake if you prefer.

    Thing is, after the IS-7 Incident stuff, you also have the Yatagarasu case, the disbarment of Phoenix, and then the murder of Mrs Cykes. And that's at the least, because if you do that all you still need to find a way to stop Dahlia, stop Gant, stop Kristoph, Manfred von Karma and The Phantom, who's identity I'm not saying for quite frankly obvious reasons because I don't want to spoil Dual Destinies.
  24. farsan

    farsan Ambulant reader

    Started plotweaving the consequences of saving Mia, and the snippet grew on its own. Hope it is adequate.

    As the wedding ceremony started, his mind couldn't avoid thinking again how things had spiralled out of control.

    'Why am I so stressed?', he thought. He had saved all his friends. All those crimes had been avoided. As an unexpected bonus, he even had finally managed to marry his childhood sweetheart. 'Why can't I be happy about this?'

    Everything had started with a simple change...

    When he discovered that he could safely change things when his life repeated itself, one of the first things he wanted to change was Mia's death. At the fateful night, he hided inside Mia's office, and waited for the right moment to call the Police and barge into Redd White before he started attacking Mia. Even at the cost of a broken arm, thanks to the Thinker statue, he had managed to stall Redd until Mia escaped and the police arrived. Redd's face when he realized all was lost was even more sweeter when he had not managed to remove Mia from his life.

    But then he started thinking. Why stop here? Why couldn't he save not only those wrongly accused from murder, but also those who were actually murdered? Did he have the duty to act on his knowledge of the future to prevent those crimes?

    Armed with foreknowledge, and aided by the fate that made him be around many of the crimes he had helped solve in the past future, he tried to prevent the murders where he was able to, even at the cost of his Law career.

    But even when he resigned from Mia's law firm, she had managed to help him find a way to help him pursue his chosen path. When she discovered that Phoenix had knowledge he couldn't have obtained by normal means, she assumed that he was a natural medium, and introducted him to her estranged family.

    Phoenix was saddened to discover that, as Mia didn't die, her spirit couldn't help Maya develop her spiritual skills summoning her, and thus her place as the Master of the Fey family was at peril. Still, he could see that Maya wasn't happy being the Master, and he thought that she could actually be happier if she could have a normal life living with her sister. Also, even if Morgan was an evil, manipulating bitch, he knew that her daughter Pearl had a good heart and would be the best Master the Fey family could have.

    Even if all the spiritual tests and trained proved mostly negative, he showed a remarkable skill using spiritually charged objects, and his 'precognition' was still proving as the real thing, so he was accepted as a medium of sorts.

    He kept preventing murders whenever he could, and also assisted Mia at the law firm using the Matagama that revealed Psyche-Locks in the new cases he had not foreknowledge of. He started getting recognition as a powerful medium, and even Morgan started respecting his skills, so she ended up arranging a marriage with her daughter Iris, which was delighted when she met Phoenix again.

    But, at the wedding ceremony, he couldn't help being uneasy. And his fears proved true when he saw the strange smile his future wife had.

    "Er... Master Pearl?" He asked. "Could you perform the Kurain Exorcism Technique? I think Iris has been posessed by her sister... again."

    He hoped this wouldn't happen at the wedding night...
  25. OathToOblivion

    OathToOblivion Destruction never looked this good!

    I accept your offering of a Snippet! I had a bit of a laugh at that ending, but it makes complete sense. I'm thinking 4 or 5 Snippets per Loop Chapter when I get around to posting this on I'd give you a Snippet of my own...but I'm kind of in the middle of making a present for a friend of mine who's in the dumps, which means I need to write like 20,000 words worth of Kamen Rider. Still, I hereby deem this Canon! ...And nobody write the Code Geass Fused Loop, I'll do that sometime within the week.